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I guess there is a rumor floating around the Internets that Barack Obama was not born in the United States. Some have been demanding to see a copy of his birth certificate. Why people have been saying that he was born somewhere other then the United States is unknown. The fact is that Barack Obama was born in Hawaii. Technically, that is in fact part of the United States.
Markos Moulitsas over at Daily Kos posted a copy of something he claims is Obama’s birth certificate. He writes:
In any case, here is Obama’s birth certificate. Click on it for a bigger version. Note, I have trimmed the edges of the scan, so before someone tries to inevitably “debunk” this based on the dimensions of a Hawaiian birth certificate, that should be noted.
Whatever this is, it’s not a birth certificate. It’s something called a Certification of Live Birth. A birth certificate is something issued at the time of birth. I don’t think even Dan Rather would think this form was issued in 1961. It looks too modern. It’s printed on anti-tamper paper and the bottom left corner states OHSM 1.1 (Rev. 11/01) LASER.
Normally something like that would mean that it’s a form last revised in November, 2001 and it’s printed with a laser printer.
A birth certificate normally has a signature from the attending physician. It also usually includes things such as weight and length. It normally also includes the name of the hospital where the child was born. More importantly, it has a raised stamp showing that the birth certificate is legit.
This doesn’t have any of those things.
I think it’s silly to argue that Barack Obama wasn’t born in the United States. I also think it’s kind of silly to present this document as an actual birth certificate. Personally, I think we’ve had enough silly in this presidential campaign.
Update: It’s not just Kos that is claiming this is a birth certificate. The Obama campaign is also claiming this is the birth certificate.
Not always is this so. For example, when I got my updated birth certificate a few years ago, it wasn’t the one with my baby footprints, as often times that isn’t a legal document (at least in Illinois). However, they had the information on file that was registered with the county when I was born in 1979. After I requested my birth certificate, they printed it out on a laser printer as it was then certified by the county clerk and a notary. Now even if Obama was born outside of the U.S. he is still a natural born citizen as his mother is a citizen. However, if we’re not going to accept that, then we must also disqualify John McCain as he was not born on U.S. soil either. He was born in the Panama Canal zone outside the U.S.
That isn’t the way it works. Just because your parent is a citizen doesn’t mean American citizenship then falls on you. You have to be born in the United States — or the territories — to be a natural born citizen. Children born on overseas military bases are also covered as natural born citizens.
I don’t believe that Obama was born outsider the United States. I just think it’s silly that anyone would believe this document was in fact an actual birth certificate.
I have something similar as a legal copy of my birth certificate. It’s perfectly legal and infact I just used it to get my passport.
However, I can see that there is an oppurtunity to have some information different than from you original birth certificate. For example, I am adopted and my legal copy of my Birth Certificate has information from my adoption that happened when I was 6 months old.
Where’s the raised seal or notary?
That what I was wondering about too. My certified copy of my birth certificate looks nothing like this. It was a form and the entries were typed on the typewriter. It also had signatures. There is also a raised seal showing that it is legit.
Then again, I’m certain this is not a birth certificate, so I guess it doesn’t matter.
From Magruder’s American Government Text Book the text book I using to teach U.S. Government:
“Citizenship by Birth, is determined in two ways: jus soli and jus sanguinis…
Jus sanguinis is the law of the blood, or to whom one is born, A child born abroad can become an American citizen at birth (so natural born-BC) under certain circumstances. The child must be born to at least one partent who is a citizen, and who has at some time lived in the United States.” -Magruder’s American Government 2001 Edition pg 613-614
Hence a natural born citizen. So if my sister who is married to a Frenchman and works in France, has a baby at a French hospital, that child still holds natural born citizenship.
As for it being a legal document, you are free to doubt that it is a birth certificate, however, many Americans have a very similar document. Often times the certificate issued at birth, is not the certificate that one gets when they go to the county they are born in and ask for their birth certificate. A birth certificate is often a document certified years later that someone was born in that county and that the county has a record of “live birth”.
Brandon, you may be right about the whole natural born citizenship thing. The only thing I’m going on was when I was stationed overseas in the Air Force. Dependents born there in the base hospital where U.S. citizens. They got birth certificates stating as such. They didn’t have to do any more paperwork or apply for anything. To the best of my knowledge, children born overseas to at least one American parent still have to apply to be a citizen. It isn’t automatic.
As far as the document being a birth certificate is concerned, I still don’t see how this document can be concidered a birth certificate. The copy I have of my birth certificate is a certified copy of the actual birth certificate that is on file in Orange County, Ca.
I think what our disagreement about, is the difference in what we consider a birth certificate. From my understanding, counties issue birth certificates. When I had graduated college I needed a birth certificate to apply for a job. When I went to Tazewell County in Illinois to receive a certified copy of my birth certificate, it was a reproduction of the information contained on the original certificate. As a current coach in Arizona, we have to verify the ages of our students in athletics to make sure they aren’t 25 pretending to be 14. Each school must have a copy of the birth certificate on file with the office to participate. The certificates are often times certified reproductions instead of certified copies. Does that make sense? It might be a state issue.
I’m not saying this is not a valid document. I just don’t think it’s the actual birth certificate.
I *think* this is what the state of Hawaii refers to as a Letter of Verification. From the Hawaii State Department website:
Looking at the document presented on the Daily Kos website, I think this is what it is.
Sounds about right to me.
I am living in Germany and am married to a German woman, (not in military). Our daughter was born last year in a German hospital. To register my daughter as a US citizen I had to travel to the consulate in Frankfurt to fill out the paperwork. We were not applying for citizenship we were registering a birth abroad, very different thing. It is up to the parents to tell the US authorities about the birth, a foreign hospital isn’t going to do it for you. A military family having a baby overseas likely has the baby at the base hospital which is a US run facility, so there is no need to do extra paperwork for the parents. My daughter is as much a citizen as me, unlike a naturalized citizen who has some restrictions left upon them, like not being able to run for President.
And this is a document similar to any you will get now a days for county records. My grandparents marriage certificate from 1930’s Chicago looks very similar. As long as it is the official govt. document, then its a non-issue, unless you are arguing that the Hawaiian govt. is covering something up.
The problems I have with the posted document is that no signature is on the document stating it is a certified copy, nor is there a stamp/seal of any type. All of us know that to have a certified copy of anything that someone must certifiy it as such. It is normal to get a copy of a Birth Certificate which is usually a photocopy of the original and then certified to being true by a government official. I had to have a copy of my birth certificate to get a passport and it had both stamp/seal and signature. Thus, what is the truth?
The issue is not really where Obama was born, but rather if Obama has forged the document in question (for whatever reason).
There are plenty of serious problems being pointed out with the pixels released thus far. It waaaay past time for Obama to release more than pixels, especially in this age of Photoshopping.
All we get is stalling.